Episode 72: What’s Possible with Logan

You are listening to the Overcome Pornography for Good podcast, What’s Possible Interviews. 

Welcome to the Overcome Pornography For Good podcast where we take a research-based, trauma informed and results focused approach to quitting porn. This approach has been revolutionary and changed thousands and thousands of lives. I’m your host, Sara Brewer.

Hey, you guys, welcome to the podcast episode this week I am so, so, oh, so excited to share what I have with you today. I have multiple interviews for you of people who have overcome pornography. There truly is nothing more powerful than listening to the stories of people who have done what you want to do.

So I'm so excited to share these experiences with you, share these interviews of members who are in the program who have quit viewing pornography, to get all of their wisdom, to get all of their hope. The purpose of this, like I want you to feel your energy rise and your belief rise as you listen to this.

Because when you listen to other people, I think I've said this before in the podcast, with some things people are really vocal about what they accomplish. Like weight loss, or if they run a marathon, or if they make a lot of money, or if they have a successful business, right? All these things people are super vocal about it like, “Yes, look at this amazing thing I've done.”

But when it comes to porn there's some stigma around it and so people aren't typically as vocal about look at this amazing thing I did, I quit viewing porn. And so because we don't hear people talking about it very often, sometimes we think either, one, not very many people struggle with this. Or number two, no one really actually quits.

But that isn't true. I want to change the narrative. Instead of it being like not very many people quit viewing porn, people struggle with this forever. No, it's normal to quit porn and it's doable. And people do it every single day. And I see that over and over and over and over again in the program. I have you guys share your wins with me and being a little bit more involved in people's lives as they join the program, like I see that. I see that and I hear story after story after story of people who quit viewing pornography.

So that's the purpose of these interviews, is to help you build belief in yourself, to see that it can be done. My favorite mantra that I would love for you to borrow, or to have because I borrowed it from someone is, if they can do it, I can too. And of course to hear these stories, to connect with them, and to see what you can learn from these stories.

You will be amazed when you hear what some of these people have gone through and the struggle that they've had with porn where they've thought “Jeez, this is something I'm going to have to struggle with forever,” to coming to a place of hope and being able to quit and seeing the amount of progress that they never thought they'd be able to see before.

Anyways, I'm not going to talk about it a lot, I'll let them speak for themselves. So enjoy these interviews. Really quickly. There will be two episodes of these, so this week and next week. And it's a little bit of a lead up to our workshop, How to Overcome Your Most Difficult Urge.

So that workshop is on June 7th. On June 7th we have a brand new workshop, it's six bucks to come and join us, learn how to overcome your most difficult urge. I talked about it in depth in last week's episode.

But the purpose of this workshop is for you to take that most difficult urge, the thing that you struggle with the most, that can be a number of things, right? Days off of work, witching hours in the middle of the night, when your spouse is out of town, after a test, with hard emotions. Maybe you have a random urge that comes up once every three weeks, maybe it's every day.

Whatever your most difficult urge is we’re to take that and workshop it and work through it. And I'm going to teach you a bunch of tools so that you can overcome this most difficult urge. I want you to get a quick win. I want you to feel empowered. I want to give you brand new ways to think about this urge and a specific applicable plan to handle this most difficult urge. And I want to do it alongside with you.

So it'll be a live workshop and then we'll also have a follow up call on the Monday following this Thursday workshop. And in these calls, you will get coaching, and help, and guidance from me and you can ask me any questions that you want. It's really one of the few opportunities that I have available at a very, very low cost or for basically free for people to come work with me in a live setting and get some individual help through a live call.

Okay, so if you're trying to quit porn you've got to be there. You can sign up at sarabrewer.com/mostdifficulturge. No spaces, no hyphens, nothing. Just the words, most difficult urge. We’ll also link it in the show notes. Okay, so go sign up for that and enjoy these interviews and drink in this success and these stories from these amazing people.

Sara: Okay, you guys, I want to introduce you to Logan. He is awesome. He's right here on my screen. Logan, do you want to introduce yourself a little bit and tell us about you and tell us your story?

Logan: Yeah, Sara, thank you so much, really excited to share my story. I think especially just because it's been, it does feel like such an achievement because it's been so long. I mean, I've struggled with viewing pornography since, I think the first time I was exposed somewhere around seven to nine years old.

And, obviously, then I didn't know what it was, I didn't really understand it. But it's something that definitely stuck with me and something that I definitely struggled with throughout all of my teenage years. And, you know, I served a mission for the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints and things were great then and had a ton of great spiritual experiences and definitely felt my connection with God and other things deepen.

And that was great. And I, for a lot of reasons, just assumed that that would be it. You know, that when I got back from a mission, like it was so freeing to know that wasn't going to be a part of my life anymore. And how soul crushing it was for me when, you know, six months later or whatever it was, there it was again. And it almost seemed worse than ever, worse than before.

And it's been 14 years since I've been home and so this struggle has been going on for years and years and years. And I couldn't tell you how many times I've actually tried to quit because after every single time I view, I think, “Okay, I'm actually going to quit. Like this is going to be it.” I mean, and that's been the psychological process for the last 20 plus years.

And I've tried other programs, I've paid for other programs in the past that have honestly yielded pretty limited benefit and fruit. I've met with a ton of church leaders, and you've mentioned it on your podcasts and in your program that there's a lot of church leaders that will say, you know, this is maybe something that you're going to have your whole life. And I definitely experienced that.

And, you know, absolutely well meaning. I will say that the church leaders and the others that I've tried to work with have been as accepting as possible and as loving. But at the same time, you know, trying to get you to really stop. And I think, gee, me too, I would love to stop.

Sara: Yeah, we love those church leaders. I just want to make sure that I say that. I think I've said this a few times but like, oh my gosh, salt of the earth. The best people.

Logan: Yeah, absolutely.

Sara: Volunteering their time, not paid for it at all, and just like want to help people. And so, you know, maybe need a little more training on how to quit porn, but that's not their job. They're not supposed to know how to help you quit porn. Anyways, but that's awesome. They're just amazing.

Logan: Yeah, and they're 100% well-meaning and I got so much from them. And if nothing else, I absolutely felt just an acceptance and a love. And anytime that I expressed confidence that I could do this, they reaffirmed that. So they were always there or always in my corner. I mean, some weren't as in my corner, I felt like, but never had really a bad experience with it, I would say.

But this kind of went on and for the last who knows, 10, 15 years it's just been the same cycle of slipping up, viewing pornography, and feeling like oh, obviously it must be because I wasn't spiritual enough. It must be because, oh, I knew it, I didn't read my scriptures yesterday or I didn't pray, or any number of items on my checklist of things I needed to do to be spiritual enough.

And so that just added to more of the shame and just added to more of the confusion of why. Seriously, I just want nothing more. If I could just spend $20,000 and have this be gone, I would do it. I just want it gone from my life. And that was just the continual cycle, that it just continued and continued.

And there's definitely times where I've gone a year or two years or long periods of time without viewing. And to be honest, those are some of the greatest times that I had ever had in my life, and it just made me want so much more, like I just craved to get back to those points where I wasn't just in the cycle of bingeing and then building myself back up and feeling like “Okay, no, this is the time this is it. I've got it this time. This must be the time. I believe that I can do it.” And then feeling just the crash again of going back to it.

And a lot of those bishops and things that I had gotten from other programs or online, you know, it always brought that connection to just notice how you're feeling and notice when you feel stressed, or lonely, or whatever it is, and just go for a run.

And it's interesting because for me, I never, it was almost like I never saw a separation between an urge to view pornography and feeling stressed, or lonely, or bored, or anxious, or any number of difficult emotions that I had no idea how to manage and process. But to me, when I felt those I just associated that with, oh, I view pornography.

And what's really cool is actually after, I didn't learn this until after I had joined your program, but it made me realize my biggest struggle all these years was I knew, I have a strong faith and a loving Heavenly Father in Jesus Christ, and I believe in the power of forgiveness completely. And I believe because I have that such a strong faith in that, that was one of the things that also led me to go to pornography.

And that might sound a little backwards. But the reason I say that is because I didn't understand, I didn't know how to process those emotions, but I did know that I could repent. And I did know that God would forgive me.

And so it almost seems like, you know, in a lot of soul searching and through a lot of thought work through your program, it made me really realize that as awful as that process was to go through the viewing, and the shame, and the frustration, and the regret and everything afterwards. I also knew how to pick myself back up from that.

I also knew that I could be forgiven. I believed that God would forgive 70 times seven. And I have experienced that to the umpteenth degree in my life. But because I had so much confidence in that, it almost just kept me in this trap because I didn't know how to process those emotions.

And that's something that I didn't really learn until I got into your program. I mean, when I first got in I didn't really know what to expect, but it wasn't what I got. I was thinking, “How is this going to help me get through this or overcome this? This is not what I needed.” But how wrong I was, obviously.

Sara: Tell me a little bit about that.

Logan: I had seen your ad several times and I'm like, “Man, if only that really did work. I mean, that would be awesome, wouldn't it?” And after, I mean it had probably only been a couple of months, I had finally gotten to a place where I had felt like I'd received a couple tender mercies and a couple insights of impressions that I had received. And I had kind of started to believe that maybe I do have the power to overcome this.

And I started just kind of having those little seeds. And it had probably been, I want to say a month, month, and a half that I had gone. And to be honest, for the prior two or three years I probably had struggled the most.

Like I probably just had the least faith that I could overcome this ever for the prior two years. And so to have that was a pretty cool experience that I had started to feel that you know what? Maybe the power is in me. Maybe I can do this.

And then I had started to see your ad a little bit. And I'm super busy, but I was like, just like everybody is, I guess. But I was like, you know what? I need to make time for this masterclass. If it really is as good as she says, then I'm all in.

And I watched the masterclass, and I was just blown away. I'm like, “What? How come I have not heard of this for so long?” Like so many things. And even just from the master class I felt like, you know what? Just from what I've learned, I think that I might be able to get rid of this for good. I might.

And I had kind of gone back and forth for a few days and I finally realized, I'm like, “How many times have I thought to myself I would pay whatever I needed just to get rid of this?” And I was like, you know what, I have absolutely nothing to lose. If it turns out to not work, then it didn't work. But I can't say that I'd be willing to pay for this to be gone if I don't really mean it.

And so truthfully at the time I really thought without it I'd be okay, I think I will overcome this. And I signed up to the program and I think it was the very end of the year, like maybe even like December 31st.

Sara: Maybe you saw the emails about the price going up a little bit.

Logan: I did. I did, I definitely did. And I was like, well, I would rather just pay for it. And I was like if it's anything as good as the masterclass then it will be money well spent. And so I signed up for it and I just started bingeing everything.

I think I had probably gone through almost every module in probably a week or a week and a half maybe.

Sara: Nice.

Logan: I just loved it. I ended up, I don't have time usually during work and things to join on the live coaching calls, but I would probably watch or re-watch two or three a week. So I probably watched two thirds of all of them that are in there, you know, catching up on a ton.

But initially though I was like, I went through it, and I'm like, “This is not what I need. This better be good.” So I started going through the videos and I started going through them and I was gradually, like piece by piece I was more and more impressed with it. But truthfully, the river of misery that you talk about, it is such a real thing.

And I think some of that is, I've kind of dissected it, I think some of it is kind of trying to reconcile how come I couldn't get to this point from the gospel? Like how come my faith in Christ didn't ever get me to this point? And I think part of that could have been the frustration of that disconnect that I found.

But as I went through the program, as I put things into practice, as I did the thought work, you know, the model that you teach has been absolutely incredible. I recognize that in my life all the time and I recognize myself just mentally going through it in different situations all the time. And then I also find myself doing it for other people in my mind and thinking you're reacting and thinking the wrong way for your situation.

But as I've done through the program I've just found so much evidence in the scriptures that backup everything that you're talking about. And I just, I have so, so many scriptures that reaffirm that. And I would say for the first few months it was actually pretty smooth sailing. Like I had probably gone four or five months.

Sara: I just want to comment on what you had said about the gospel and Jesus, and trying to reconcile the two. And, well, I just really appreciate you bringing that up, that this is the gospel. This is the gospel. And I tell people, I tell them two things changed my life the most, finding Jesus Christ and the model.

And I think that the model is the gospel. And when I read and search in the scriptures, I do find evidence of that. And you've probably noticed in the program, like it's not religion based.

Logan: Yeah, that’s correct.

Sara: I don't talk about that, really, in the program. And I don't talk about it very much in my podcast either. And so I just say that because I know that I have listeners who aren't members of a religion. And so I don't want them to think that if they do want to come and join us they're going to be bombarded by that. Absolutely not.

But like change and repentance and they all work together, and I just really love that you said that and agree 100%.

Logan: Yeah, thank you so much. And just to affirm, yeah, if you're not a member of any faith, or Christian, or religious at all, you're not going to get any vibe of that, I don't think, in the program. But I've just made my own connections to my own beliefs and the faith that I have to the things that I've learned. And the connection with repentance to the model is just, I mean, it has deepened my relationship with myself and with God so, so much. So it’s really powerful.

Sara: I remember being like, “Oh, wait, this is grace. This is how I access grace. Okay, so I learned about grace my whole life, but I haven't really got it. But now that I have these thought tools, okay. I know how to access it now.”

Logan: Yeah, absolutely.

Sara: It's just kind of a cool thing.

Logan: Yeah, it's super cool because, and like I said, because I felt like I was pretty smooth sailing for a few months, or several months. Probably four or five months that I hadn't viewed any pornography. And one of the things that I had to kind of adjust was, you know, you talk about counting and processing urges and things, and I feel like I didn't have a ton of urges.

And what's crazy to me is I feel like I was the least restricted that I'd ever been. I was the least restricted with social media and different things and I just had this freedom that I didn't feel like, “Oh, well, if I have Instagram on my phone, then I'm just bound to slip up.” Where that's how I felt prior to the program.

And so learning and realizing that the situations of pornography are never going to go away. They're going to be there the rest of my life, you're never going to fully escape those situations. And so, what I loved about the program is that it taught me how to be okay with that, how to get through that and to the point where it just, it doesn't faze you. Where it doesn't make you feel powerless and that, oh, I have this urge and so I guess I have to give in. And it's just stuff that I had never learned prior to that point.

But things were really smooth sailing. And I actually, there was a situation that had come up where I just started to feel this immense shame and I just had no idea of really why it came. I hadn't viewed pornography or anything, but I felt as if I had. And I just had all this old shame that was just piling up and piling up. And it kind of stuck around for probably a week. And it was one of the most miserable experiences of my life.

But as I just kind of stuck to what I had been doing and processed things, it actually taught me a lot of things. And one of those things particularly was, where is this shame coming from? I mean, God, if I have faith in a God, like God doesn't want me to feel this shame. I couldn't find any evidence where God wanted you to feel shame in the scriptures. There's no evidence that He wants you to feel terrible.

Yes, of course, you're going to feel guilty of doing wrong things. But the kind of shame that I was feeling is not what he wanted me to feel. So I actually, because of that shame, I did end up watching and viewing pornography, which was really frustrating. But in the end, part of that frustration too, that I had viewed was because I had been taught my whole life that the amount of time that I had gone without pornography is how I value where I'm at spiritually, in essence.

And so what was really cool is that that whole process of shame and everything forced me to really change my beliefs, really just challenge a lot of the thoughts and the beliefs that I had had previously. And I began to shift everything that I had thought previously about how I viewed myself with this challenge.

And I just really learned that my anchor and my success had nothing to do with the time. It had to do with what I've learned, and what I've experienced, and the skills that I had gained and the concepts that I've learned. And so I went through, I actually created a, I think a notebook that has probably 30 different bullet points on it. I think I titled it like why I'm closer than ever to never viewing pornography again.

Sara: I love it.

Logan: And it was just a bullet point of just all these things that I've learned. And anytime that I feel, you know, that I start to question or doubt or whatever else, I go back to that notebook, and I'll just start reading them until I feel good again, until I just have that faith again.

And it's been so, so powerful to just put my anchor on Christ and my anchor on what I'm learning and the skills that I’m actually getting, instead of it's been six months, or it's been a year, or it's been two weeks, or two days, whatever it is. And so it's just been so, so powerful to learn those different skills.

And changing the beliefs overall, that's been so, so powerful. You know, things that I, it's hasn't even been just revolving around pornography, but I've applied it to every area of my life. One that comes to mind is I feel like, from an outside perspective, I think, I mean, I’m college educated and have a great job. And my family and parents, they all probably think I'm doing great and very successful.

But when I go to work or when I go to different situations, honestly, I have that imposter syndrome. I feel like I don't belong, like for some reason I shouldn't be here. And this is just an example of, so I want to illustrate this because this has nothing to do with viewing pornography, but it's something that has changed my life and something that I approach every single day, which is my career.

So because of the model and how I've been able to apply that in this situation, I actually no longer feel like, oh, I don't belong here. But totally the opposite, I have so much more confidence in my skills and my abilities and what I can contribute. And almost the opposite, I feel like there's no one better that you would want in this instead of feeling like I'm some imposter.

Sara: Love that.

Logan: And so it's just, it's been so cool to just feel that shift because for, again, I've been into my career for over a decade now and I, for that entire decade, have felt like it's just I don't belong. Like there's people that are so much smarter than me, or they see things differently or whatever else. And so that confidence isn't just as it relates to pornography, but every aspect of my life, for sure.

Sara: Yes, I say that. I say this is about so much more than quitting porn. And so thank you for illustrating that. Yeah, it'll apply everywhere.

Logan: Yeah, absolutely. And I guess to get a little bit even more specific, I mean, I feel like I have a great family, loving parents. But for some reason I've never had the greatest, or at least probably around the time that I probably started going to pornography when I was a teenager, I feel like I've never had the same relationship with my dad.

And it's not that I don't love him or that we don't have a good relationship. But sometimes, like it just, I never really let him into my life for some reason. It was almost like, this might sound really bad. This is probably harsher than it really is, but it's almost like I would tolerate him in some instances instead of really kind of letting him in.

But it's been really interesting since all of these different changes that have happened, not just overcoming viewing pornography, but in my career and family and different things, but it's really interesting to see how my nature has kind of changed for that and I've been able to allow him to come into my life. And I've actually reached out to him to invite him into my life a lot more.

And again, not to say that he wasn't a part of my life at all. But my relationship is so much better with him. And not just him, honestly, probably everybody because I just, I let people in so much more. And so it's been such a healing and freeing process to go through. And I would say just every day it's kind of something new.

I would say for the better part of 20 years, my life everyday has been, has almost revolved around, okay, what do I need to do to stop viewing pornography? How do I get this out of my life? What do I need to do today to make sure that I don't view pornography?

And then here comes, you know, back with the checklist and things that I needed to do to and to be perfect at. Otherwise I'm sure, if I forgot to do something, then I'm sure that's why that I viewed pornography. But it was this total paradigm shift with my mind where I no longer woke up every day and thought, oh, how do I overcome this? And it was just a shift to, wow, everyday I now, well, what do I want to do? I can do whatever I want.

And when I start thinking about my life without pornography and when I start thinking about what I can achieve and what's possible, it's really cool to just, it's almost even scary at first. Because I never really experienced it to that level of just I can really choose to do whatever I want to do.

And so it just, it was so freeing to be able to have that shift that it was no longer about revolving my life around what do I have to do to escape and run away from this? Instead of just I had the opportunity to just choose what I wanted to seek out and to choose the life that I wanted to live. And yeah, this has only been 6, 7, 8 months now, but it is such a massive change from where I have ever been in my life.

Sara: Talk about breaking chains.

Logan: Yeah, it's so, so crazy. And breaking chains, I mean, again, everything that you taught, when I first came upon it it's just not what I expected, I would need to break that chain. And it's just been so cool to see how it's just influenced every part of my life. And actually one of your other coaches, one of the coaching sessions that she did, she mentioned a book, I can't remember exactly what's called.

 Oh no, it's called 90 Seconds to a Life You Love that she had referenced. And it just talks about emotions and feeling those. But there was just one line in it that I just loved, which was learning how to feel your emotions and understand them and process them is essentially what keeps you living a life of default instead of living a life that you design.

And so what I've loved is not just saying it in your program, but actually giving you the skills to do that. To really recognize your emotions, to recognize what you're feeling, to recognize what you're trying to escape when you go and view pornography. And really being able to really break those chains and to change those mindsets and to change the beliefs that I have had about myself this this whole time.

So it's been, yeah, it's been awesome to just feel those experiences and to go through it. And I think the biggest thing is just to feel those changes and to feel just the freeing nature that comes with that.

Sara: Yeah, it's one thing to say feel your emotions, it's another thing to actually do it. It’s a lot more difficult and you have to figure out how to do that. And it's the same idea, it's one thing to say, yeah, we're not going to live our life off of what other people want us to do. And then it's a whole other thing to actually do that.

Logan: I mean, I sometimes wonder like, how come I was never taught this as a child? To understand and to recognize this, because the way that you respond to these emotions, it means everything. And that doesn't mean that I'm perfect at it yet. There's still definitely times where I'm like, okay, I need to be better in that area, or that area, or whatever it is. But just knowing what it is that I'm working on and knowing how to do it is just so freeing.

I mean, I can't really explain when it's just you no longer fear the what if. What if an urge comes up? I'm just not afraid of it, it's okay. And that's just right in line too with my religious beliefs. Because I feel like there's a scripture that I love from the Bible in second Timothy, one seven, and it says, “For God hath not given us a spirit of fear, but of power and of love and of a sound mind.”

And that, I feel like through this struggle of this up and down struggle of viewing pornography and the shame that came after, feeling like I'm never going to overcome this, and then building myself back up. Like I just realized that's not the process that God wants me to go through.

He doesn't want me to feel powerless. He doesn't want me to feel this shame. He wants me to feel faith and He wants me to feel the love that He has for me as as imperfect as I am. And He wants me to feel that I do have the power to make that change. It's not something that has this control over my life, or it doesn't have to be.

And so I've loved, it's just so cool to have that shift from living your life of, structuring my life around this fear of what could happen or if an urge comes up, to making that transition to just having faith and having the confidence that you have what you need in order to face any of those challenges that come up.

Sara: Yeah, and having that like self-trust in yourself too.

Logan: Yeah. Yeah. And that comes through practice, right? I mean, so one of the things that I started to mention earlier but probably sidetracked myself, which was I didn't feel like I had a ton of urges at the beginning that I could process.

So one of the things that I kind of adapted, and this is one of the things that you talk about, is learning how to self-coach and how to recognize where you're at. Because nobody's going to know more than me of where I'm at and what I'm feeling.

And so, one of the adjustments that I did make in the program that was really, really powerful for me was instead of counting the urges, because there was probably a lot of months where I didn't have that many. Now when they did come it was really cool because I learned to really sit through that and to process it and to get through it.

But one of the things that I did instead is that I counted, actually, anytime I had a temptation to kind of lust, you know, from a woman that I saw in public, or something that I saw online, or whatever else. Anytime that I had that emotion or feeling, I would process it. Even small or quick little emotions, I would process that and use that as my counter. That's kind of what I counted through tons and tons of different times.

But it's been so freeing, and it's interesting, it was really cool to experience. I was watching a movie with my wife, and it was nothing, you know, not an inappropriate movie or anything. But I remember about halfway through the movie, I remember thinking, “Oh my gosh, I haven't been objectifying this beautiful actress that's on the screen. Like I haven't even been thinking about it in that way, I've just been watching the movie.”

And that was the first time probably in my life that I can remember experiencing that. And so it's been really, really powerful to experience that time and time again, where I know that the program is working because little things like that. Like it just never would have happened, I probably would have constantly had images in my mind or something.

And so it's been really powerful to know that the changes aren't just, you know, skin deep or on the surface deep. But they're really changing, making changes to me and the way that I think and the way that I act and the way that I am. It’s really been freeing and just enabling to know that I have those skills and of what has come from the program to be able to do that.

Sara: Yeah, that's beautiful. Thank you. I had someone say to me the other day like, “Okay, but do you really, like actually talk to people who change?” Because there's so much disbelief around it, you know? Like no, I've been told my whole life I'm going to struggle with this forever, I can't even imagine me being able to watch a movie without objectifying the person on screen.

Logan: Yeah, but that's been me, right? That's been me my whole life. I have never, I mean, a year ago I just, I never even could have fathomed being where I'm at right now. That just, it's not even a consideration. Like I just never believed that that was an option.

And so that's what was so powerful, I guess, with the masterclass that I watched, because instantly I just felt like, “Oh my gosh, maybe this can happen for me. Maybe this isn't something that has to plague me for the rest of my life.” I mean, that's just how I viewed it for myself, was like it was just something that plagued me, and I just could not want this to be gone any more. Like my desire for that to be gone was as strong as it could be.

And it's interesting to have experiences after the fact that I honestly just feel so much gratitude that it wasn't ever taken from me. Because the things that I've learned, the skills that I've needed to overcome it have benefited me in every aspect of my life. And made changes to my relationships to work, as I mentioned before, with my wife, and my spouse and family and children.

And so it's been so cool to see how it's impacted every area of my life. You know, I had a child, a new baby a few months ago. And being present for this experience and being free from something that has just haunted me for my whole life, it's been such an incredible experience.

To go through those experiences with family and to not have it be a part of my life. To just be free from it, to be fully present, to be fully there to feel all of the love. It's brought my relationship with my family so much deeper. It seriously is so, so powerful.

Sara: I literally got chills when you said, looking back like I'm glad it wasn't just taken from me. Because that's one of the first things you said. You said I would have paid $20,000, easy, to make it go away.

Logan: Yeah, it has turned to being something that I actually, like that I appreciate. One of the things that I just try to do anyways is to have, you know, just practice kind of some gratitude every single day. And some of that may be kind of going through the things that I've learned through the program and things that I've come to understand.

And one of the biggest things is just, is that gratitude for the program, for everything that you've taught us, for the skills that I've gained from it. Because, I mean, truthfully, I think before I signed up for the program one of the things I think I said at the beginning was I was pretty confident that based on what I've learned in the masterclass, I just think that I will be able to overcome this. I'm so confident, I've never felt this.

Yes, I have built myself up and told myself that I'm going to do it or that this will be the time. But I'd never felt that kind of confidence, I had a reason to be confident to believe that I really did have the power to make these changes.

So I initially thought that back before I'd signed up for the program, I thought, you know what? If I don't sign up I think there's still a good chance that based on what I've learned, I think that I'll overcome this. But now going through the program and learning what I really needed, I’m like, yeah, I wasn't even close.

These things that I've learned about myself and these things that I had been missing, like just the missing puzzle piece to why I could never figure this out would still be missing if I didn't sign up for the program. And it's interesting because I just keep learning.

There's so many more insights that I just keep learning about myself. And I think that's the coolest thing, is that you've taught us how to teach ourselves these things. You've given us the skills, you have the modules. And there's so many things that may not even be written or said that they’ve gone through that, you know, insights that we learn about ourselves that are just life changing and so empowering to experience.

So the program, I mean, seriously, it really has been life changing. I can’t adequately describe that, but it's just absolutely changed the course of my life.

Sara: Well congratulations. And it's just incredible, you have such a great, great story. You've really shown up for yourself. I think it's interesting how, you know, that's a common thing with porn, we're like, “No, I'm going to figure it out. I'm going to figure it out on my own. And I'm going to take care of it on my own. And I have this new information, I'm going to keep trying it on my own.”

But what typically happens is we keep trying on our own and we're not really making as much progress as we could if we were having some help. And so the act of faith that it is to say, no, how many times have I told myself I would pay to get rid of this? And now here's an opportunity. Because it's not just a magic pill that you can take and make it go. And I wish it was. If I had one of those I would be throwing them out like candy, right? You have to trust in yourself, that's what that is.

That decision is no, I'm going to trust in myself. And I'm going to take a chance on myself. And I'm going to believe in myself enough that we're actually going to make this happen.

Logan: And I want to point out too, I mean, it's not just the act of paying for it and signing up for the program that got it done, right? I mean, I think there's a few things that you've kind of highlighted. That going through the modules and things, the milestones, this is great.

But the people that will go through the thought work, the people that will go through the model, the people that will challenge and change your limiting beliefs, those are the people that are going to make that difference. Those are the people that are going to see that success. And it's really just a dedication to everything that you've laid out in the program that has brought that success.

Sara: Yeah, there's a difference between listening and then applying.

Logan: Yeah.

Sara: That's the container for application.

Logan: Yeah, absolutely. So as I've gone through that, I mean, it's definitely been work, right? I mean, there's been effort that has had to go in. And, to be honest, I probably listened to either your podcast, or one of the milestones, or one of the coaching sessions, or some of the bonus material, which is awesome by the way.

I've loved going through a lot of that bonus material as well that you have, the bonus workshops. But I will listen to that usually on my way to work and on my way home from work. And then throughout, you know, at night or during lunch hours or whatever it is, or in the morning I will go through and do some of that thought work. Or even just when I have five minutes. If I notice something, I'll write something down and get to it.

But the effort that I've put in and then the results that I've got from it, it's just so different from just spinning your wheels. And that's where I felt like I've been for 20 years before I came to your program. I just felt like I was spinning my wheels, spinning my wheels, I'm putting in this effort, I'm putting in this work, and it's just some really meager results.

Sara: Well and it’s so much more effort too.

Logan: Yeah.

Sara: Thinking about those cycles you'd gone through and the willpower and the exhaustion and the discouraged. And just like that’s so much more work than this thought work. It’s just different, it's totally different energy.

Logan: Yeah, the effort that you put in is like it almost, in comparison it just feels like I'm spinning my wheels. I'm just going through the motions. I'm just hoping and grasping at straws sometimes it seems, going through all of this effort. And in my case it was meditation and prayer and trying to be as spiritual as I could. And felt like, oh, this is what's going to help me to get through that.

And what's interesting, you know, learning about over desire and learning about the things that I was buffering from. And learning about how to actually approach that and deal with that has enabled me actually to become so much more spiritual and to just recognize the love that God has for us in such a deeper way than I really ever have.

And so, it's been really cool to go through that process and experience a process that's effective, that has been tried and true, and that has worked for so many people. And I assume there’s so many people, it's definitely worked for me. But it's been just so freeing to go through that process.

Sara: Yeah, thank you so much for sharing that, so good. I experienced the same thing where I just, like my spirituality, and I say this because I sent out an email a couple days ago where I said, “What doesn't work with quitting porn is praying more and fasting more.” Some people interpreted that like maybe it's not important, which wasn't what I was trying to say. It's so important.

But also learning these skills alongside it just build, build on whatever faith that is.

Logan: Yeah. Yeah, that's that's been my experience, is that learning these skills has just deepened my ability to build that relationship with God. It's made it so that when I do pray and when I do fast, I'm getting so much more out of it because I'm freed from this thing that has haunted me for so long. And it's just liberating to experience that.

Sara: Yeah, so good. Thank you. So thinking about someone listening to this who's like, “Okay, but Logan's a unicorn and he can do it, but I can't.” What would you say to that person?

Logan: You know, I think there's a tendency to always, you know, our parents do a good job of telling us that we're the special one and we're special people. But truthfully, as I listen to my story I just, I feel like it is so standard.

I feel like there's so many people that have experienced the exact same things, that struggled with the same things, and have gone and had the same conversations with spiritual leaders as I've had. And, you know, have given up and reaffirmed that we're going to do it, this is going to be the time that we've quit. And I feel like my story is, in a lot of ways, I'm just me and I'm just, I think I'm pretty standard and pretty usual.

And so anybody that is thinking about it, anybody that is wondering is it worth it? I mean, I know, it's a lot of money. And they’re right, honestly it is. But at the end of the day, I would have paid so much more for the experiences that I've had, for the skills that I've gained, and for the type of life that it's given me now and the type of life that I can choose to live and create for myself, you know, past the limiting beliefs that I had. And especially the biggest one of can I overcome this? Can I ever ditch this habit?

And knowing what I know now, I mean, I would have signed up 100 times out of 100, there's no reason I wouldn't. For me, there's so much to gain and everything to lose. I mean, I just can't adequately describe where I'm at now versus where I was a year ago.

And so if there's anybody that is wondering, you know, well, maybe it's just me, and maybe I just got lucky, yeah, I haven't gotten lucky for like 25 years with this. And nothing has worked. And I have tried so many different programs that have come highly recommended from what I can find online or from spiritual leaders, whatever it is. I've tried in group stuff through our church. And it's not that they're bad, but it just did not work for me.

And Sara's program just gets right to the point. It just gives you the skills that you need. It teaches you exactly where you're at, why you're in the situation that you're in, and she gives you all of the education to get yourself out. And again, that doesn't mean that it's easy to do, but the skills are there.

For me, it was never a lack of effort. It was never that I wasn't trying enough. It was that I just didn't understand it. I didn't understand why I was struggling with this. I didn't understand why this is something I kept going back to that I obviously hated so much because it was just ruining such a big part of my life.

And so for me, again, it just wasn't a lack of effort. I feel like I always had that effort. Going into the program it taught me where to apply that effort and what to spend my time on and how to spend that time. And to me that was what has been so liberating.

And as a side benefit, it's impacted every area of my life, which I just can't, I mean, I can't thank you enough for what you've done and for the way that it's transpired throughout my life since I've joined the program.

Sara: Well, thank you. And I do want to reaffirm here that you are the hero of this story. You are the one who has come in and made these changes, and you should allow yourself to feel like extremely proud of yourself for getting where you're at. Like that’s all you.

Logan: Yeah, and I definitely do. I definitely feel that, which is why I have that notebook of the things that I've done and learned and the things kind of where I put my anchor now, instead of with time. But it's been so great. And, yeah, I mean, you're not wrong. I mean, it's definitely filled me with much, much more confidence in me and what I can do and what I can achieve.

You know, the emotional regulation that I feel like I now have in my life, that I'm not so erratic with anxiety, and guilt, and shame, and faith, and then more guilt and shame after that. And like just the emotional regulation that I felt is absolutely life changing. I mean, it's so, so powerful.

Sara: Well, you think you're going to come in and quit porn, and you do, you quit porn. But then you also get better relationships with people, you get more confidence, you get less anxiety.

Logan: Yeah.

Sara: You get a lot more from going through this process.

Logan: Yeah, it's been awesome.

Sara: Cool. Well, thank you so, so much for coming on and sharing that. Is there anything else that you want to say?

Logan: One of the things that I have been trying to figure out for the last, I guess 14 years, since I came home from my church service mission was there was a concept that I learned on my mission, which was to take your foot off the gas and then you can put your foot on the brake.

And for 14 years I feel like I had been trying to figure out what is fueling this. I've been trying to figure out why do I continue to have it? And I know that might sound crazy, but if you're struggling with this, you probably understand it. I could never figure out what the fuel was other than the sexual desires. Like I just could never really figure out what it was.

And so, to me, like if you're struggling to understand what is fueling that and what is keeping that going, to me that's where the power of the program comes in because Sara will walk you through every single step of the skills that you need, and what you need to understand, and the concepts you need to know.

And you'll be able to understand for yourself what is fueling that. You'll be able to recognize in your life, “Oh, this is what is going on. This is why I keep turning to that.” And just knowing that one piece felt like brought me so close to just feeling like I would be away from pornography forever, just learning. Because now at least I understand. I understand what's going on and I understand where my mind is at. And so that's the other thing. The last thing is understanding what's fueling it is crucial.

Sara: So what was that for you? You don't have to go way into it, what was that?

Logan: Yeah, I touched on it briefly earlier, but the thing for me that was fueling it was all of these emotions that I had no idea how to process. The line had become so thin for me of feeling lonely, or rejected, or discouraged, or anxious, or stressed out, whatever it might have been.

To me those emotions were almost synonymous with an urge to view pornography because it was just so automatic free that, oh, that's what I'm feeling. I'm feeling an urge to view pornography. And so for me learning that those were emotions that I had not learned how to process and to feel and to be okay with, but they were things that were keeping me going back to pornography, that cycle just continued.

And we talked a little bit more about my view on why I would go that way because ultimately I feel like I knew how to process and pick myself back up from viewing. But for me, those were the things that really kept me in that cycle, was that I didn't really make that connection.

I couldn't make that connection and understand that feeling those difficult emotions, again, they were just synonymous to me with feeling an urge to view pornography. They weren't really a separate thing in my mind. And so being able to recognize that and pinpoint that and to make those distinction in my life has been so, so freeing.

Sara: Yeah, awesome. Thank you. Okay, again, thank you so much for coming on and sharing today. I know it's super inspiring for a lot of people listening.

Logan: Yeah, hopefully, it's been helpful. And yeah, I would have just no reservations for your program. I hope that everyone can experience what I have and go through those experiences. It's been, you know, nobody could have adequately explained the work and the changes that would happen, but also the joy and empowering feelings that would come from that, and the total 180 shift from where my life was before the program.

Sara: Yeah, awesome. I'm so happy for you.

If you're ready to apply what you're hearing in this podcast and finally overcome pornography for good, I'd love to be your coach. I've created a virtual program with the intent to give you everything that you need to quit. Once you join you have lifetime access to the content and lifetime access to individual support through coaching calls and coaching boards.

For more information check out sarabrewer.com/workwithme.